Difference between revisions of "Player Dev Meeting 1.0"

<&pip> we can get feedback and allow the players to basically mold the game as they want

<&pip> at least, they can help avoid problems that arise from miscommunications between players and admin

<&pip> my first topic was going to be whether or not to allow more ppl in here

<&pip> my plan was that if we were to do that, put the channel on mute and give only 1 person per team "voice"

<&pip> only those ppl would be able to type anything

<&pip> and ppl with voice could give their teammates their voice if they want

<&pip> the question is, would you guys want more ppl in here

<Trev-SP> I like the idea that the original players get to pick one person to join them in the chat, This one person can stay or change.

<Llessur-TFC> We need more rep from lower ranked teams, those with lower level characters

<&pip> anyone else?

<HoochDealer-Aidelon> I don’t really see the need for more than 1 rep per team here

<HoochDealer-Aidelon> they can always tell their team in vent what’s going on and ask the opinions

<&pip> llessur, if we have too many, it would just be a mess in here

<Trev-SP> Lower lvl teams are still in low lvl content, i think this is about high end content 

<Llessur-TFC> 4/10 is not a good turnout

<&pip> not sure how we could allow more players without some hard limit on the players

<&pip> this is kind of late notice

<Trev-SP> Its 4/10 because people dont relies how much this will effect things, once the first meeting is posted people will want to join.

<&Dorth> well, I like the see but no talk

<&Dorth> They can always tell their rep if they got something to say

<&Dorth> It's a filter

<Llessur-TFC> yes

<&pip> yeh, we  could make this public to everyone, and then have just the top 10 talk

<Neuraxis-DM> nah bad idea

<&pip> would that be ok llesur?

<Llessur-TFC> sure

<&pip> the issue i have with that is when we're discussing some future features or things that may not end up going in

<&pip> then ppl might clammer for it

<Llessur-TFC> its the up and coming teams that get screwed

<Neuraxis-DM> screwed how?

<&pip> i'm ok with making it public, I'll just have to be more careful about what is said in here

<Neuraxis-DM> haha

<Llessur-TFC> its the moving goal posts thing, they need a say

<Trev-SP> I dont agree with it being made public.

<&pip> maybe we can decide this for sure when we have more ppl?

<+Llessur-TFC> ok

<+Trev-SP> Yea, maybe when 10/10 teams are here.

<&pip> alright

<+Neuraxis-DM> probably be better making like an arena galaxy ingame where only certain players can enter for SS meetings

<&pip> heh

<&pip> IRC is not hard to get

<&Dorth> That seems more trouble than worth :S

<+Neuraxis-DM> none of this mad chat client jive

<&pip> being on here is a privilege, if the teams don't want to do it then they dont have to

<+Neuraxis-DM> suppose

<&pip> we'll wait on this till we have more teams

<&pip> we could decide on when to meet that would be easier for everyone

<&pip> i think it would have to be earlier, maybe on the weekend?

<+Neuraxis-DM> same time as reset

<&pip> 1pm est saturdays?

<+Neuraxis-DM> but on a Saturday or Sunday

<+Llessur-TFC> It would have to be a sunday to make it a weekend for everyone

<&pip> why?

<&pip> is saturday not weekend for some?

<+Llessur-TFC> sorry make that Saturday :)

<&pip> heh ok

<+HoochDealer-Aidelon> sat night would be a weekend for eveyone, not sunday

<&pip> saturday, 1pm eastern

<&pip> that too early for PST?

<&pip> 10am

<&pip> lets do 2

<+Llessur-TFC> what is that in GMT time

<&pip> that way its 11am pst

<+Neuraxis-DM> thats 7GMT iirc

<&pip> 6gmt

<&pip> 7 london

<&pip> since they're diff right now?

<+Trev-SP> 1 pm Central time.

<+Trev-SP> No-one :P

<+Neuraxis-DM> GMT and London are different?

<+Trev-SP> Is this gonna be a 1 week meeting

<+Trev-SP> or every 2weeks?

<&pip> lets do one this week

<&pip> and we can decide thigns there

<+ERMAN-Traders> for the record, I think that if this channel is open to everyone that it would get too hectic. I think that well informed representatives from major teams should be involved as they will supply the best representation of the ideals of each team.

<+Llessur-TFC> weekly is easier to schedule

<+Trev-SP> Make a Sticky locked topic in dev. 

<&pip> ERMAN, it would be muted so only V would get to talk

<&pip> anyways

<+ERMAN-Traders> oh, is V = gray names?

<&pip> we'll get back on that next time

<&pip> yeh

<&pip> if you're using chat client

<&pip> chatzilla*

<&pip> lets move on a bit

<&pip> we updated this:  http://wiki.starsonata.com/index.php/Next_Patch

<&pip> during our dev meeting

<+ERMAN-Traders> that would be good then, that would eliminate the clutter while allowing a good flow of information

<&pip> ill give you guys a couple minutes to review that

<&pip> everyone ok with the info on that page?

<+ERMAN-Traders> was a decision made or the topic of ubers in wild discussed tonight?

<&pip> jeez

<&pip> hold on

<+Neuraxis-DM> nothing has been discussed

<&pip> here is what admins decided for the ubers

<&pip>     *  Should DG ubers all be in Perilous space?

<&pip>           o Ubers will remain spread out as they are (some will be able to be blockaded as is the case this uni) 

<&pip>     * Should we remove/reduce spawn times on all ubers with lockout (to something like 15 minutes)?

<&pip>           o Uber spawns will be 30 minutes max. 

<+ERMAN-Traders> ok, the 30 mins needs a patch? or can the spawners just be changed?

<&pip> Jey will be changing the spawners soon

<+Trev-SP> I think all Dg ubers should be in PErlious

<+Llessur-TFC> Excellent

<+Trev-SP> I also have a problem with the lockout for CG/Emp

<&pip> ORB will be changing them in XML so future unis will be the same

<+Trev-SP> Well this way

<+Llessur-TFC> I agree with trev

<+ERMAN-Traders> i agree trev, that was my initial suggestion

<+Trev-SP> because 1 lion key can =4 runs.

<+ERMAN-Traders> they dont agree though

<+Neuraxis-DM> i bet it was

<+Trev-SP> take 2 sets of people for example, with 1 lion key, Do Emp twice in 30mintues

<+Trev-SP> Because how lockouts work, only people with aggro get kicked, or locked.

<&pip> we talked over the lockouts

<&pip> to make sure this 30m would be ok

<+Trev-SP> You kill CG first 4 go in

<+Trev-SP> kill CG in 15mintues

<&pip> ok

<&pip> i'll bring HAL in

<&pip> just a sec

<+ERMAN-Traders> you can change the others, just not emp?

<&pip> well they're all affected

<+ERMAN-Traders> ah, cool beans

<+Llessur-TFC> 15min spawn is good

<&pip> it will be 30m

<&pip> did i write 15?

<+ERMAN-Traders> no

<+Llessur-TFC> at the top

<&pip> ah

<&pip> 30min isnt bad

<&pip> thats the max

<&pip> like, if you're outside the gal when they kill it

<+Trev-SP> 30 minutes is more than perfect.

<&pip> and jump right after

<&pip> most of the time it will be 10-20m

<+Llessur-TFC> yep the slow spawn time is a big issue in TFC

<+Trev-SP> However for DG bosses

<&pip> that's all i have for tonight

<&pip> i want to keep this short since we'll have one this weekend

<+Trev-SP> The DG is hard to get to, DC at the end, A few teams sit in the lvl before DC.

<+Trev-SP> Also if you dont mind add a "5 mintues before you are kicked" 

<&pip> that shouldn't be hard

<+Trev-SP> So that you know you’re going to get kicked from the gal, after the pulse happens

<&pip> i can tell jey to add that

<&pip> put it on the next patch page?

<+Trev-SP> But he still needs a pulse kickout

<&HAL> why?

<+Trev-SP> Well, say 8 people go in with 1 Lion key

<+Trev-SP> 4 kill the CG

<+Trev-SP> And warp to emp

<+Trev-SP> Wait 30mintues

<+Trev-SP> Repeat

<+Trev-SP> Only using 1 Lion key for 2 emp runs

<+Trev-SP> could put a 20mintue lockout on Cg, so that the pulse has time to kick them

<&HAL> I don't know, there is potential for people to get kicked out on their way to emp that way

<+Trev-SP> 15minutes?

<+Trev-SP> Thats a long time.

<&HAL> lowering it will only make the problem worse

<+Trev-SP> Its 30mintues actually

<&HAL> my point is that a group could kill CG, get held up for some unforeseen reason in that room waiting for something, then get kicked out before they can warp into the emperor room

<&HAL> then they have wasted a key for nothing

<+Trev-SP> Some way you have to keep a bunch of people taking turns killing emp.

<+Neuraxis-DM> like people spawning GSAs in stealth ships that need no GG ^^^

<+Trev-SP> With only using 1 key

<&HAL> I would like to bring up the possibility with Jeff to change the way the keys in UZ work

<&HAL> so that they aren't used up

<&HAL> but maybe everyone in the group needs one to go through the wormhole

<+Trev-SP> I just dont want to see 15 people waiting in CG with using 1 key and taking 

<&HAL> emp should not be soloable

<+Neuraxis-DM> which is already flooded

<+Trev-SP> Emp is 3 manable

<+Trev-SP> Heres an idea hal, The gate to CG lvl requires the Nogro key but doesnt take it from you

<+Trev-SP> And when warping into emp it takes the CG+norg key

<&HAL> I'm not sure we support multiple keys to a gate, but I will check

<&HAL> no currently a gate can only have 1 key

<+Trev-SP> There is also the possiblity without a kickout, you can camp Cg.

<+Trev-SP> Or hal when you go into emp it starts the kickout for CG

<&HAL> well the other problem if you add a kickout to him

<&HAL> we will almost certainly get 10+ tickets per week when someone zoned into CG after someone else killed him

<&HAL> and then they get kicked out and their key is wasted

<+Trev-SP> Make the gate lock on the outside until the 30mintues is up.

<+Trev-SP> So as soon as a group warps into Emp, the Kickout timer starts.

<+Trev-SP> And locks the outside gate for 30mintues

<+Trev-SP> you dont even need to add my last 2 sentences

<+Trev-SP> Since they aggro pulse has already been given out

<+Trev-SP> It doenst matter if he spawns.

<+Trev-SP> Doesnt matter if somoene warps in there while another group is doing it, as thats already an existing problem.

<&HAL> personally I would rather just make emp harder than the boss you need to kill to get the key to get to him

<+Neuraxis-DM> should be way harder anyway

<+Neuraxis-DM> all the uz should

<+Neuraxis-DM> kinda late now tho :(

<+Trev-SP> well you cant beef things because we older generation got better

<+Trev-SP> Think about the new generation..

<&HAL> that solves all this problem without a fucking loopedy loop of what the fuck programming to try to make it so people can't kill the same boss a couple of times with the same key

<+Trev-SP> Hal if you dont see a problem with a boss dying several times with the same key, dont change it

<&HAL> and probably just generating 10x the number of complaints in the end when some unforeseen circumstance screws people over

<+Trev-SP> But i assure you we will abuse it.

<+Neuraxis-DM> you will abuse it *

<&HAL> I can make emp hard enough that it doesn't make sense for you to do it

<+Neuraxis-DM> that would be nice

<+Trev-SP> You cant change old things to suit the older players

<+Neuraxis-DM> it is stupidly easy

<+Neuraxis-DM> why not?

<&HAL> if we increase the difficulty we aren't buffing it

<&HAL> we are unnerfing it

<+Trev-SP> Because have you ever played another game Neuraxis

<+Trev-SP> Look at Wow

<+Trev-SP> The use to be impossible stuff is now easy

<+Trev-SP> Well i compare alot of things to wow

<+Trev-SP> Because we have alot of stuff like wow

<+Neuraxis-DM> what i am saying is ... the old players are flooding the market with tons of UZ gear because it is SO easy

<+Trev-SP> And in Wow, The impossible becomes easy and the new becomes impossible

<+Neuraxis-DM> i always wanted the uz beefed

<+Neuraxis-DM> always

<+Neuraxis-DM> i always said it was too easy

<&HAL> do you have any other issues you would like to bring up?

<+Neuraxis-DM> yeah Beta Antares

<+Neuraxis-DM> i saw a noob the other day go to get his ship in a pod ... he docked and didnt have engines 10 ... so he was stuck there

<+Neuraxis-DM> couldnt buy another ship and couldnt undock

<+Neuraxis-DM> i think i sent a ticket tho

<+HoochDealer-Aidelon> personally, I'd rather we got away from the way the levling systems works now, make it base on time playing SS

<&HAL> I think our leveling system is broken, but there isn't much we can do about it now

<+Neuraxis-DM> scrap it?

<&HAL> and do what?

<+Neuraxis-DM> start again before C2?

<+Neuraxis-DM> get those pens and pencils out

<&HAL> there isn't anything we can do that isn't likely to alienate half our player base

<+HoochDealer-Aidelon> I think a way to fix the power leveling issue would be to give AI with say 500+ lvls above the player a +% damage done to the player

<+Neuraxis-DM> lol

<+Neuraxis-DM> thats not a bad idea

<+Neuraxis-DM> except Emp would rape everyone ... as would hives etc

<+Neuraxis-DM> but thats not too bad either

<+HoochDealer-Aidelon> those are not ment to be easy anyway

<+Neuraxis-DM> indeed

<&HAL> there is something to be said for the fixed level system like in WoW, makes things a lot easier to balance

<&HAL> I'm not sure we can really do anything with an open ended leveling system that doesn't break down at some point

<+HoochDealer-Aidelon> the above idea could be scaled just like the XP reward is, in fact the same scale should suffice

<+HoochDealer-Aidelon> that would force all players to kill AI near there range

<+HoochDealer-Aidelon> or they could lvl in groups